Ep. 60: The New 10,000 Steps with Ray Zahab
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Ray Zahab is a professional explorer who has crossed some of the most unforgiving environments on Earth. He ran across the Sahara in 111 days and traversed Baffin Island nine times, most of them at the height of winter. In conversation with Medcan CEO Shaun Francis, Zahab argues for the age-defying and stress-busting benefits of adventure travel. Like Shaun, Zahab is an advocate for the Japanese practice of “forest bathing” and argues that we can access similar perks by just getting outside and exploring nature. It’s an inspiring conversation with a 52-year-old explorer who is not letting the pandemic keep him down. In fact, he’s vowed to exit lockdown restrictions in the best shape of his life.
INSIGHTS
It is one of Zahab’s most foundational beliefs that people underrate themselves. He argues that most anyone has the capacity to accomplish so-called impossible tasks. Zahab’s experience conforms to that edict. After all, he won the first ultramarathon he ever entered. “Many of us underestimate ourselves physically, mentally [and] emotionally at some point in our lives. And we're capable of so much more,” he says. (12:34 - 12:48)
Someone recently messaged Zahab about how to start running: “I’m not a runner, but I would really love to do a run someday. I don't even own running shoes. What do I do?” Zahab said, “you get off the couch on day one, and you walk to your front door, and you put on whatever shoes you have any kind of shoe, you lace them up, then you take them off and you walk back to the couch. That's the end of day one. Day two, you put the shoes on, you walk down to the end of your laneway or the end of your block, turn around, you walk home. Day three, you walk to the running shoe store — you get what I'm saying? A marathon starts with the first step.” (14:05)
Running gets a bad rap. Everything’s all about, how to avoid getting injured while running. But if you follow a proper mobility and running program — running is exceptionally good for you. “It’s a hell of a lot better for you than not doing it,” Zahab says. (18:08)
Doubt has afflicted Zahab, same as anyone. At the start of his Sahara expedition, Zahab left the west coast of Senegal and passed the first days of the 100-day-plus journey mired in low self-confidence. “I thought, all right, there's no way I'm making that,” Zahab recalls. “There's just no way. These guys will make it and I will not. But I'll go as far as I can. And that's all I can do.” But somehow, he did it. (23:03 - 23:35)
On ultramarathons, desert crossings or Arctic expeditions, Zahab does what the Fleetwood Mac song says: “Don’t stop thinking about tomorrow.” In other words, take it one day at a time. “You get on day 60 [and you’ve] got 50 more days to go. Fifty. Like, forget it. The mind doesn't go there,” he says. “It's like, ‘okay, I'm going to get through tomorrow. And then tomorrow when we get in, we're gonna have something to eat.’ That's all I'm thinking about.” (27:03 - 27:36)
Zahab believes in the Japanese concept of forest bathing – surrounding yourself with trees to reap the wellness benefits. “I've always felt [a close connection to nature when I’m running], to everything that's around me — that we are one connection,” he says. “We're one piece … and when I'm running, that is like a meditation for me.” (27:50 - 29:12, 29:34 - 30:44)
Zahab believes in the human capacity for achievement. “I'm a big believer that you define what your goal is and work backward from there. There's always a plan. There's always a way.” Amen. (32:34 - 32:33)
LINKS
In the 2014 documentary film Running the Sahara, Zahab and two fellow ultramarathoners crossed Africa’s Sahara Desert from Senegal to the Red Sea in 111 days.
Known as one of the “Goose People”, Zahab is a frequent product tester and representative for Canada Goose.
Testing endurance and will, the Marathon Des Sables is just one of the footraces Zahab has completed. Twice. Learn more about Zahab’s adventures around the world by visiting his website.
Zahab is the founder of the non-profit organization Impossible2Possible that aims to push people to surpass their limits, and encourage youth to use adventurous experiences as a learning tool. He also creates once-in-a-lifetime expeditions and adventures through his company Kapik 1.
Zahab recommends the book The Hidden Life of Trees, in which author Peter Wohlleben argues that the forest is a social network. It is available on Indigo and Amazon. Another one of Zahab’s favourite reads is Chi Running: A Revolutionary Approach to Effortless, Injury-Free Running, available on Amazon and Indigo.
Zahab documents his journey on the Trans Namibia Expedition in a compelling video. There, he and his team ran 60 kilometres a day in extreme heat.
To learn about the Japanese practice of forest bathing, go here.
How to Use Adventure Travel to Beat Stress with Ray Zahab final web transcript
Christopher Shulgan: Hi folks, Christopher Shulgan here, the show's executive producer. At Eat Move Think, we've been thinking a lot about travel, nature, adventure, getting away, the great outdoors. And it's not just us. Real estate values in the countryside are skyrocketing. Which is funny, because these days, outside is a place that has become optional. Even when restrictions are lifted, we can get anything we want on the web. Streaming services bring us entertainment, our phones bring us information, and social media brings us friends. But somehow, it's not enough.
Christopher Shulgan: We're all feeling the drive to get outside—and we're missing nature when we can't. Our host, Shaun Francis, talks a lot about the Japanese practice of forest bathing. That's the philosophy that hiking, forests, the seashore, that being in these natural environments combats stress and anxiety. In fact, there's an argument going around that two hours a week in nature is becoming the new 10,000 steps. As in, a benchmark you need to check off to ensure you're taking care of yourself.
Christopher Shulgan: Which brings us to our guest in this episode. Few people on earth have been outside as much as Ray Zahab. Zahab is an explorer-in-residence at the Royal Canadian Geographic Society. He's run across the Sahara, crossed Siberia's Lake Baikal and Baffin Island in coldest winter, and traversed pretty much ever superlative desert on planet Earth. He's a founder of the adventure travel company, Kapik1, and as a so-called Goose Person, he's a product tester and representative for the high-end outfitter Canada Goose.
Christopher Shulgan: In conversation with Medcan CEO Shaun Francis, Zahab argues for the mental wellness, age-defying and stress-busting benefits of not only getting outside, but also for adventure travel. It's an inspiring conversation with a 52-year-old explorer who is not letting the pandemic keep him down. In fact, he's vowed to exit lockdown restrictions in the best shape of his life. Here's Shaun's conversation with Ray Zahab.
Shaun Francis: Hi, it's Shaun Francis and welcome to Eat Move Think. Today, especially with where the world's at with COVID and lockdowns, I think getting outside, getting exercise, having life goals, for many of us have been put on hold. And I thought who better to have on our show than Ray who can talk to us about how he's dealt with I'm sure a tough period for him too, and what we should be getting prepared for now that we're coming out of COVID. So with that, Ray, welcome to Eat Move Think.
Ray Zahab: Thank you, Shaun. Thank you. Great to be here.
Shaun Francis: Thanks for joining. How's your year been? How does somebody who's a global explorer and ultramarathoner deal with being locked down and sheltered in place?
Ray Zahab: Well, you know, it's an interesting thing. I was on expedition in the Canadian Arctic January, 2020. And then I was guiding clients immediately after that in Siberia towards the end of February 2020. And then I got home, and then we went into lockdown. And basically everything I do stopped. So I'm a professional explorer, I travel around the world, I do really long foot-based expeditions. And I use those expeditions as a way to support my charity, Impossible 2 Possible. But also, I guide people on expeditions, and I talk about expeditions. I speak at corporate events all over the world. So everything stopped, because of course you can't travel anywhere. So Shaun, for sure, there was a part of me that sort of was in freeze mode, where I'm like, what the hell? I can't take care of my family anymore, I'm not gonna be earning a living, everything is stopping. And I thought to myself, "Geez, I could lose a lot of sleep over this." Or, I mean, it's reality. It's what's happening. Things are stopping, people are sick, people are dying, this is a horrible thing. But I'm gonna have to deal with things in my own way.
Ray Zahab: And so I sort of flipped it around in my mind in how I was going to sort of get through COVID. And it didn't take very long for me to figure out—like, I'm talking a matter of days where I was like, all right, I'm totally reprioritizing my health, my fitness. I'm not training now for an expedition, I'm training to be in the best shape I can possibly be in for a multitude of reasons related to COVID. From stress to buying groceries for my neighbours who were a little bit older and wanting to make sure that my immune system was as high as possible, to having the kids at home. And my kids are athletes, and being willing to get out every single day and do a second workout with them. This kind of stuff, you know what I mean? Like, you adapt, and a resiliency comes about from things like these pandemics, I think.
Shaun Francis: Oh, for sure. And everyone's had to tap into some inner resilience to lesser and greater degrees to get through this. You talked about doubling down here on your fitness level. You are a guy who crosses Baffin Island, and doesn't mind the Arctic. But how have you done that during lockdown?
Ray Zahab: What I propose to people, and to the people that I'm connected with is, you know what? Instead of looking at it as a situation where I'm not gonna be able to train for the thing that I'm gonna do, I'm gonna train for the right now. And it was actually sort of liberating in some ways. If you're talking about from a physical training and mental training perspective, to instead of training for some huge expedition that I was gonna be doing, was to, like, totally refocus on just being quite literally in the best shape of my life. Eating as good as we could, making meals as a family together, and discovering new ways of eating super healthy food. The spillover to that is that I'm preparing now for projects and expeditions, and I'm going in actually a lot fitter than I normally am, because I've had a year.
Shaun Francis: Let's talk about that for a moment. Sounds like you're eating well, you're working out, you're sleeping well?
Shaun Francis: Oh, yeah. Well, sleep's a big thing. Sleep's the most important thing, right? So I'm already somebody who doesn't—as you can tell, high energy, you know, never want to sleep. But I sleep. And I've been getting better at sleeping, because I've actually had time over this past year to track my sleeping more, like, really get into the science of it, wearing sleep trackers, and really understanding HRV and all these other measurements that determine how well we are sleeping, and why we are sleeping and why we aren't sleeping. I'm in a much more controlled environment in lockdown, if you will, from February through 'til—or March last year, sorry, through 'til the spring. It was like Groundhog Day every day, right? So I knew exactly what I was doing, exactly what time, exactly when I was gonna eat. And you know, you press repeat every day. So you were able to sort of figure out why or why not you were sleeping.
Shaun Francis: And what about your workout routine? Do you work out every day?
Ray Zahab: I do. I train every day, you know, depending on what I'm training for. If I'm training for a winter Arctic expedition, it's a different sort of training profile than if I'm training to cross a desert in the middle of summer. Generally speaking, I train based on elevation gain. That's how I run. I don't base my training on distances, but rather time on feet and getting a certain amount of elevation positive in each day. Then of course, you do a bunch of functional strength training and mobility work and those sorts of things, that become again, increasingly important. I'm 52, they become increasingly important the older I get so that I can still perform at a high level.
Shaun Francis: And how do you train for elevation? Are you outside doing that?
Ray Zahab: Yeah. I mean, by elevation, I don't mean altitude training. But I mean, like, running up hills. So I live in the Gatineau Park. I shoot to get 1,000 to 1,300 feet every 10 kilometres of running vertical. And so, you know, my daily goals might be 2,500, 3,000 feet today. And I can get it quicker, which makes it much harder, or I can get that elevation easier, if you will, but the run becomes longer, because it's more slope-y. You know what I mean?
Shaun Francis: Yes. Yeah. And does that mean you're out, like, for a few hours a day running? Or do you go longer?
Ray Zahab: So it depends on the terrain that I'm in. But I typically trail run very technical terrain, or I cross-country ski in the winters and fat bike, and I mountain bike as well. So I mix it up. But my goal, end goal, is to go into every expedition as fit as I can possibly be, but well rounded.
Shaun Francis: You talk about being in the best shape of your life. Let's go back in time, because there was a time when you weren't in the best shape of your life. Can you talk to us about that?
Ray Zahab: Sure, sure. So, you know, when I was reaching the age of 30, I was a pack-a-day, two-pack-a-day smoker. I was a guy who was a non-completer of anything I would start. Barely got out of school, did not complete my college studies. You know, I just was sort of directionless, without goals, and a very unhappy person inside who was fabricating a happy exterior. And I was just sick of faking it. I was sick of not having passion in my life. And, you know, I was in the lowest of my lows, and my brother, who's an amazing outdoor athlete, ice climber, mountain biker, got me into trying some of the things he was doing, because he was so passionate and gaining so much confidence from the things he was doing that I thought, wow, maybe my life could be different if I just sort of took a different perspective and maybe tried some of the things he was doing. And that was kind of the first steps. I quit smoking. Turned my life around 180 degrees. And within a few years, I was racing mountain bikes all over the world and doing adventure races. And that led me to ultra running, which eventually began racing in ultramarathons. And then I ran across the whole Sahara Desert. And that's what changed everything.
Shaun Francis: A lot of people talk about wanting to change. Do you recall a single moment where you decided you had to change?
Ray Zahab: Truth be told, it wasn't. It was more nuanced. It was just like a dread. A dread and a tiredness of never being committed to anything or challenging myself in any way. And just sort of coming to a resolution that this just was not gonna work. I mean, it was not a survivable lifestyle. I was also polluting my body with other things. 30 more years of this, was just—I just could not see it happening, you know? I just couldn't picture it, right? And so a change had to happen. Now when it did happen, as passionate as I was about driving a trainwreck life—if I could put it that way—before, I became the exact opposite. And I learned that through challenging myself and pushing myself. I had a whole new—a second life, if you will. I was reborn. I had this engine that could do these long feats of endurance. And instead of talking myself out of doing things for fear of what others might think, I started talking myself into taking risky chances and doing things and trying new things.
Ray Zahab: And I just didn't care what anyone else thought. I was like, to hell with this, I'm living my life. No regrets. You know what the other question that people ask me all the time: do you have any regrets? None. Because I wouldn't feel as great as I do now. At 52, I feel better than I did at 35 and for sure, better than I did at 25. But if I had one major epiphany, that moment, that pivotal moment that you asked about, it would have been in my very first running race, which was 100 mile or 160 kilometre non-stop running race in the Yukon, which I subsequently won to my disbelief. I'd never won anything like that in my entire life. And what it taught me, and the epiphany was, is that people underestimate themselves. All of us—or not maybe every single one of us on this planet, maybe there's a lucky few that don't, but many of us underestimate ourselves physically, mentally, emotionally at some point in our lives, and we're capable of so much more. That taught me that.
Shaun Francis: It sounds though that you didn't start off though doing a 100-mile race. You got back into physical activity first, that might assume—because if you said "Okay, my first thing is gonna be 100 miles."
Ray Zahab: Like, to give you the briefest possible chronology, you know, I quit smoking, and then I get into climbing with my brother. Got really big into ice climbing, you know, general mountaineering. Like, really basic stuff and a bit of rock climbing. And then at the same time was into mountain biking, got really proficient at mountain biking, started racing 24-hour solos and mountain bike stage races, and then got involved in adventure racing. But in the span of about three years, I became really, really good shape. I mean, I went the other way completely, right? Like, I mean, I'm eating broccoli every night. Like that kind of thing. And I read an article about ultramarathons, and I entered my very first race in the Yukon, which would happen months later. So February 2004, I stood on the start line of my very first ever official running race. I'd never ran a marathon, 10k, any sanctioned running events, if you will, I'd never ran before.
Shaun Francis: Incredible. It sounds like, okay, I want to change my life. But I'm not sure it's gonna be 100 kilometre Arctic races.
Ray Zahab: No, no, no. Dude, I just wanted to be happy.
Shaun Francis: Yeah.
Ray Zahab: I just wanted to be happy.
Shaun Francis: And you got outside, just doing some climbing.
Ray Zahab: I had somebody message me recently, and they asked me, "I follow all your posts. I'm not a runner, but I would really love to do a run someday. But I don't even own any running shoes. What do I do?" And I said, "Well, you know what you do? You get off the couch on day one, and you walk to your front door, and you put on whatever shoes you have, any kind of shoe. You lace them up, then you take them off and you walk back to the couch. That's the end of day one. Day two, you walk back, you put the shoes on, you walk down to the end of your laneway or the end of your block, you turn around you walk home. Day three, you walk to the running shoe store." You get what I'm saying?
Ray Zahab: A marathon starts with the first step. We see these images, we're bombarded daily with images of what perfection is supposed to be. And we all have lofty goals in our minds, because that's what we do as human beings, we position ourselves down the road, we picture what something's gonna be like. But there's a process with everything. And the harder the process, the better the end of the journey is going to be.
Shaun Francis: Now doing that Yukon race, you said you hadn't done an official running race up until that time. Got it. And so how did you prepare for 100 miles in that kind of weather?
Ray Zahab: It's sort of this "ignorance is bliss" theme that has followed my life almost in a Curb Your Enthusiasm or Seinfeld kind of way for the last several years. I started reading books about how to run in snow, because I had no idea really, for sure. So I had a couple buddies of mine help me structure a running program. And through that, and through reading some books, I discovered a book called Chi Running. It's still in print. It's incredible. And it was Googling "running in snow" and combining these running tips I was getting from my buddies, I learned how to run in sand. And it was like the same principles. And that's where I started from. And I realized I had to be ambidextrous in this journey, that I was gonna have to know how to move laterally and be willing to learn different things from different people. Which incidentally, the writer of that book, Danny Dreyer and I would eventually meet. And I explained to him how impactful his book was, because if it wasn't for his book, I may not have ever finished that race, I don't know.
Shaun Francis: You went from biking to running. What feeling did you get running that you weren't maybe getting biking that caused you to unleash so many of these ultramarathon adventures?
Ray Zahab: Nobody's ever asked me that question. I gotta tell you that's very insightful. I would say the process that I went through, when I was on a mountain bike, if you said to me, "Go ride that race. It's 1,000 kilometres," I'd be like, "That's far, but I can get it done." But running 100 miles, running 50 miles was further than I'd ever gone on my feet in my entire life in one go. I think in one of the eco-qualifiers, we did 50k of trekking. That was the furthest I've been on my feet through the woods. So when I reached that 50-mile mark in the race of the Yukon, I was in disbelief that my feet could take me that far, let alone 100 miles. And my feet were still attached to my body. Like, they didn't fall off. So the potential for growth and learning about myself was so exceptional that I've said many times that running would become my greatest teacher, because it would teach me things about me and the world, and open opportunities up to me that never existed before and just weren't coming from mountain biking, if you will. I love mountain biking, it's still my passion. I got a couple of mountain bikes, I ride them whenever I can. But running became something different for me.
Shaun Francis: Almost like a mental challenge, like an audacious mental challenge that got really exciting.
Ray Zahab: Yeah, that's a great way to put it. You know, mountain biking is like reading a book that you kind of know the ending because your buddy gave you the spoiler. But running was that book that you opened up, and you thought it was gonna be something and it was something completely different, and you're hooked and you can't put it down.
Shaun Francis: Do you worry about the repetition, the impact of running versus cycling? Have you felt it personally with everything you're doing?
Ray Zahab: No. I mean, both sports are uniquely good for you, incredibly good for you. The thing about running, I think it gets a bad rap. There was a time in the running industry when everything was designed around you not getting injured. Get this shoe with this post in it, it's got a billion inches of cushioning underneath it, and read this article in this magazine that is about you not getting injured. So from the get go, somebody goes to buy their first pair of running shoes. "I don't want my knees to hurt" Where does that come from? Where's the scientific evidence that running is bad for your knees? Running and impact is good for bone density, it is good for our cardiovascular health. I mean, you know, you follow a proper mobility program and running program, it's exceptionally good for you, as cycling is exceptionally good for you. It's about finding what you love. If it makes you happy, and you're in the fresh air, and you're working out, That's a hell of a lot better than not doing it.
Shaun Francis: You're right, I don't use a lot of evidence that says, your need for a hip displacement is augmented by running. Like, I think we tie it together. We say bad knees, bad hips, you know, don't run so much. But I do recall looking at some literature and talking to some orthopedic surgeons, and they say, "Well, it's we're not really sure, frankly, how you get there." And if it's overweight and not running versus something else, or it's purely just genetic.
Ray Zahab: Well, it's like the person who eats super healthy vegan their entire life. To look at them you'd say, "Oh, my gosh. That's the epitome of health," and they have a triple bypass. It's genetic, right? Look, somebody is going to call me out for my process. I'm not saying my process of how I followed my running journey is the proper way to go. If anything, it's not. But I think that the greater good of running, there's much more good about it, but you don't hear about that as much. You hear about the injury more than you hear about all of the cases where people have changed their life completely through running or cycling or active lifestyle. And that should be more of the emphasis. Let's get moving people. Let's get healthy. It's just better for society and for the individual.
Shaun Francis: Ray, a lot of what you've done is event-based. It sounds like that too, might be something that is exciting and inspires you. I mean clearly, getting out the door and buying your running shoes is the first step, getting back to climbing or ice climbing or just something recreational. But you went beyond that, you actually put events on your calendar. Is that part of the process?
Ray Zahab: I think goals are part of the process. And it's not just words. I truly believe that those unique experiences that we all have that fulfill us are gold medals. I mean, if the Olympics is your goal, great. If it's just make it around your block without wheezing is your goal, that's an amazing goal. Everything is relative to the individual.
Shaun Francis: Talk to us for a moment on the Sahara. I mean, it seems it launched this journey into professional adventurer and global notoriety. How did it come about?
Ray Zahab: Well, a couple of buddies and I, we were doing races, ultramarathons together in different parts of the world. And we met a couple of times, and this crazy idea came up to try and run across the entire Sahara desert and see if we could do it, right? And so that's how the idea came about. You know, the basic statistics, 111 days, 7,500 kilometres, no days off. We crossed six countries. We were always together, never more than a few meters apart. I mean, it was a very exceptional project for us at the time. And it taught me that I had a voracious appetite to want to learn. Although I was a guy in school who barely got out of school—I mentioned that before—didn't care about anything in the classroom setting. I was learning about economics, agriculture, social issues. Everything you can think about, water crisis. All of this because I was on an adventure across North Africa. And that sort of pivoted in my mind why I was doing what I was doing, and what I would do in the future.
Shaun Francis: How did you prepare for the Sahara? It sounds like you were doing something that you obviously did in the Yukon. Did you have to do a lot more to prepare for 111 days of ultramarathons?
Ray Zahab: Well, I just kept racing. I just was doing a bunch of ultramarathons. I raced in Libya, I raced in Niger, I raced in the Amazon jungle. You know, I just kept on doing these different ultramarathons. And then we left for the Sahara. I mean, the last race I did before we went, I did it with the two guys, with Charlie and Kevin that I ran across the Sahara with, and we did it in China. In—goodness, memory don't fail me now. Late 2006, let's say, or mid 2006. And then we were in the Sahara by November, 2006.
Shaun Francis: And was there ever a moment in the Sahara when you thought you wouldn't finish?
Ray Zahab: Yeah, the first day I started. When we left the west coast of Senegal, I looked at my two buddies who were very accomplished ultra runners. And I thought, all right, there's no way I'm making it. There's just no way. These guys will make it and I will not, but I'll go as far as I can. And that's all I can do. And as long as I go as far as I possibly can, I can't be bummed about that. I'm just gonna go as far as I possibly can. And, you know, somehow I made it to the end.
Shaun Francis: Incredible. For our listeners, we can watch this, right? Is it available as a documentary?
Ray Zahab: Oh, yeah. Yeah, so the documentary film, Running the Sahara was produced by Matt Damon and narrated by Matt Damon. So it was—for the younger people out there, Matt Damon is a Hollywood movie actor. Had to make that joke because every time these youth ambassadors on our youth expeditions, they never know who he is. It was in theatres and everything. I believe it's on iTunes. It is on iTunes, because I just actually gifted it to someone the other day. And Netflix I think in the US.
Shaun Francis: Great, so we can download that and take a look at the journey.
Ray Zahab: Yeah.
Shaun Francis: How many deserts, or how many of these have you done since the Sahara?
Ray Zahab: Well collectively, including the Sahara, I've ran about 20,000 kilometres across pretty much every large desert on the planet. I'm only missing one or two. So I've crossed Patagonian Desert, the Atacama Desert, the Namib Desert, the Gobi Desert, etc. As well I've been to the South Pole, which is the world's largest desert, across Antarctica. And multiple cold expeditions. I won't bore you with all the details, but winter Arctic expeditions and Siberian expeditions, and a lot of summer desert expeditions.
Shaun Francis: Do you have any favourites? Is there a top five? A top two? A top one?
Ray Zahab: Well, a place I love the most is the Canadian Arctic. I've crossed Baffin Island in one form or another nine times. I just love that place. I also love some of the most extreme places. I guide a lot in the Atacama Desert with my clients, with my guiding business, Kapik1. And it's just such an incredible, an extraordinary environment. I just can't describe it. So the Atacama Desert was also probably one of the hardest things I ever did. It's in Chile, by the way, if anybody's wondering. I crossed from the Peruvian border south to Copiapó. If you remember those miners that got stuck underground, 33 miners. It was there. So about 1,200 kilometres. I did that in summer 2011, with limited resupplies, it was very, very hot. But I take my clients to a much more beautiful spot in that desert than where I was.
Shaun Francis: Baffin Island. Do you cross that in skis? Are you running it?
Ray Zahab: I've crossed it in skis, running, fat bike, unsupported, minimally supported, you name it.
Shaun Francis: And are you doing that during the winter when there's no light?
Ray Zahab: Oh yeah. Last January, I left the island of Qikiqtarjuaq, which is off the eastern coast of Baffin. And I ran across that little bit of Davis Strait that's there. And then when I got off the frozen sea ice, then I crossed Baffin. I had all my gear, food, everything. I dragged it on a sled. It was dark. The sun came up. I was there sort of like, I think it was, like, third week of January if I'm guessing right on my memory here. And the sun was, like, literally just cracking the horizon. I get about an hour or two of daylight, you know, decent daylight, and probably about four hours of dusk-style light.
Shaun Francis: And are there any mental models, mental tricks that you use that might be applicable to listeners to get you through some of those long nights and days?
Ray Zahab: I am very sort of streamlined in my thinking in that I think about food and what I'm gonna eat at camp that night. And if I can just get through the day, 10 more K, we start setting up camp and I'm gonna start eating. That's all I think about. I mean, really.
Shaun Francis: And is it also fair to say, like, you're really thinking day to day, right? It sounds like that. Like, I got to get to the next camp. And you're not saying "I need to get through 30 more days."
Ray Zahab: No, because if you think about it, in running the Sahara, for example, on day 60 of running 70 kilometres average a day, every day sand dunes, 50 degree heat, everything. No bathing, nothing, right? Or one shower in 111 days. Two showers, I should say, over the course of the entire expedition. You get on day 60, you got 50 more days to go. 50! Like, forget it. The mind doesn't go there. It's like, "Okay, I'm gonna get through tomorrow. And then tomorrow when we get in, we're gonna have something to eat." That's all I'm thinking about, you know?
Shaun Francis: Yeah. And I recall on doing some mountaineering, the experts would say "Never think about getting back to the hotel," If you start off and you're already thinking about that warm shower, you're not in a good place. You know, the Japanese have this term called "forest bathing." And in short, you know, what it means is there's something to our mental outlook and our health if we can reconnect with nature outside, moving. Do you think there's something to that?
Ray Zahab: No, I believe that 110 percent. There's a book called—I think it's called The Secret Life of Trees or something like that. And it's about a—I'm not sure if the fellow was an agronomist, or some sort of scientist. Anyhow, he determined that trees communicate. And I've always felt that when I'm running, this close connection to nature, to everything that's around me, that we are one connection, we're one piece. We're not several separate entities, that we are all directly connected. And when I'm running, that is like a meditation for me, you know, running on a 30-degree hot day in the summer, on our trails, hearing Quebec when it—I mean, the forest turns into a jungle because it—and it actually smells a lot like the Amazon because of the decaying and composing leaves and everything else, and the heat and humidity. And I feel complete connection to that forest when I'm out there. That everything's alive around me, but not just alive, but conscious.
Shaun Francis: And so many of us don't—I mean, lockdown may be exacerbating that, right? But so many of us lack that connection. And especially with devices, even, you know, for young people, you're pulled into it, because you can be entertained mentally, all day long, right? And you don't need to get outside. Everything comes to you.
Ray Zahab: There's a lot happening there in what you just said. And I'm very fortunate that I live in a community that's very outdoors based. All the kids in my community, they're all involved in trail running or mountain biking or skiing or whatever, right? But if you live in an urban environment in the middle of a global pandemic and you're in lockdown, you do not have a lot of outlets into the outdoors. That is a significantly difficult situation to be in. And what I learned from many of my friends that live in some of the densest urban environments on the planet—Los Angeles, Rome, New York City—is that they would find in any way they could possible that ability to just get out and move and have that fresh air, or fresh city air, whatever you want to call it. But getting to a park. If the park's too crowded? Okay, going in a different direction. Walking out the front door and going in a different direction every day and walking for 30 minutes. Just getting outside and putting the devices down. You know what it's like. I mean, everybody's working from home now. You know, you get in front of that laptop, and one Zoom call to the next, you don't even know the temperature outside, right? It's almost like you have to program these breaks into the day.
Shaun Francis: For people that are interested in an expedition, and I know I've taken people a few times to Kilimanjaro, for example. And that's probably a good example where it seems like, you know, it is a big goal. It's a very hard thing to do. But it's mentally achievable. You've heard of other people accomplishing it who weren't extreme athletes. What are some of those sorts of experiences that you think our listeners ought to consider?
Ray Zahab: I mean, look it, shameless self-promotion, Kapik1.com. We're booked solid this year. But, you know, we create expeditions that are from an introductory level to an advanced level, depending on where someone is. Unsupported across Lake Baikal in Siberia, or the Atacama which, believe it or not, can be more entry level for people. It's really about exploring your own backyard, right on up to climbing Kilimanjaro.
Shaun Francis: What about events? Something like a Marathon des Sables? How does that compare with what you did?
Ray Zahab: The beauty of Marathon des Sables is you make friends from all over the world. It's such a multicultural, if you will, event. And one of my favourite ultramarathon racing memories is being in the Marathon des Sables with friends that I went with. So it's a completely different thing. I mean, yeah, planning and doing something like that, it's achievable completely.
Shaun Francis: Right. So somebody could say, "Look, I'm gonna focus on doing that two years from now, and get myself moving."
Ray Zahab: 100 percent they could. For sure. I'm a big believer that you define what your goal is and work backward from there. And there's always a plan, there's always a way.
Shaun Francis: Ray, thank you very much. Having goals, committing to something, getting off the sofa, committing your life to getting outside and staying young. And Ray, you're a real example of that, and a great Canadian on top of that. So thank you for your time today. We really appreciate it.
Ray Zahab: Well, thanks Shaun. It was great to reconnect with you, especially this way and get to talk face to face. It's been so long. So hopefully, I'll see you again down the trail soon.
Christopher Shulgan: And that's it for the conversation between Medcan CEO Shaun Francis and the explorer Ray Zahab. Learn more about Zahab's expeditions at Kapik1.com and RayZahab.com. You can also find him on social media @rayzahab. Here's hoping you can find some outdoor time.
Christopher Shulgan: I'm executive producer Christopher Shulgan. Find show notes and full episode transcripts at EatMoveThinkpodcast.com.
Christopher Shulgan: Eat Move Think is produced by Ghost Bureau. Senior producer is Russell Gragg. Tiffany Lewis edited this episode. Editorial and social media support from Chantel Guertin and Emily Mannella.
Christopher Shulgan: Remember to rate and subscribe to Eat Move Think on your favourite podcast platform. Follow our host Shaun Francis on Twitter and Instagram @Shauncfrancis—that's Shaun with a U—and Medcan @medcanlivewell. We'll be back soon with a new episode examining the latest in health and wellness.
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